| Author |
Message |
    
Monty
Inspector
Username: Monty
Post Number: 167
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 11, 2003 - 11:11 am: |       |
Folks,
Going through my Sourcebook last night.
Came across Cox's statement re Kelly and Old Blotchy Face.
In Cox's statement it reads that Blotchy was wearing a soft felt Wideawake.(P405..I think)
At the inquest Cox's states that Blotchy was wearing a Dark Billycock hat (P415/416...again, I think).
Two different hats !!....and it wasnt even questioned !!!!
Now whats that all about ??
And more importantly....does it matter ??
Baffled Monty
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Christopher T George
Inspector
Username: Chrisg
Post Number: 233
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 11, 2003 - 11:38 am: | |
Oh Monty, I think you have knocked the whole case into a cocked hat!   |
Martin Fido
Detective Sergeant
Username: Fido
Post Number: 78
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 11, 2003 - 6:34 pm: | |
It's a very interesting observation, Monty, and one full of warnings for us all about the unreliability of witness statements, especially if they were taken down from dictation or by court reporters who might have misheard. The two hats are really completely different: a wideawake had a broad brim (being wideawake because of this difference from the narrow-brimmed slouch hat); a billycock was a high-crowned bowler (derby for Americans) supposedly invented or used by William Coke of Norfolk as a more convenient riding hat (with minor crash helmet advantages) than the traditional topper.
All the best,
Martin F |
Robert Charles Linford
Inspector
Username: Robert
Post Number: 408
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 12, 2003 - 7:35 am: | |
Hi all
In her police statement Cox said the blotchy-faced man had a "black felt hat." Hutchinson reported a "dark felt hat." That word "felt" does make me wonder whether the type of hat worn depended on which policeman was taking down the statement.
One person who seems never to have worn a wideawake is George Clapp. His hat was a soundasleep.
Robert |
Monty
Inspector
Username: Monty
Post Number: 169
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 14, 2003 - 11:08 am: | |
Martin, Robert, Chris,
Roberts post has beaten me to a correction. In the sourcebook it does indeed read that Cox's statement mentions blotchy having a black felt hat and not soft felt hat as I stated. Sorry. But I am sure a widewake was mentioned along with Cox and Kelly somewhere. I was going through 5 different books at the time and may have mixed them up. I shall re-check.
Martin,
I have a question for you regarding Billycocks. As it has links with a theory a friend of mine is working on I would rather like to ask you privately..if that is possible.
I would understand your reluctance to do so and any decline on your part would be totally accepted and respected by myself....but as my Mum says "if you dont ask....."
Cheers,
Monty
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Robert Charles Linford
Inspector
Username: Robert
Post Number: 416
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 14, 2003 - 11:41 am: | |
Hi Monty
Hutchinson in his statement to the "Times" Nov 14 uses the words "soft felt hat". Sarah Lewis saw a man across the street wearing a "wideawake black hat" (probably Hutchinson).
Robert |
Monty
Inspector
Username: Monty
Post Number: 172
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 14, 2003 - 11:46 am: | |
Robert,
That may be where I went wrong. The thing is, I was specifically looking at Mary Cox statements in different books and therefore had no need to look at anything to do with Hutchinson.
As I mentioned above. I shall go back through the books I used....Eddleston keeps jumping into my head, I think I shall try his book first.
Thanks anyway,
Monty
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Scott Medine
Detective Sergeant
Username: Sem
Post Number: 105
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 14, 2003 - 4:10 pm: | |
Good observation there Monty.
Hmmmmmmm.............
Peace,
Scott
Wide-a-Wake in Athens. |
Monty
Inspector
Username: Monty
Post Number: 174
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 11:24 am: | |
Scott,
Perhaps not so good in one way...but theres a connection....of sorts.
Monty
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Shelley Wiltshire
Sergeant
Username: Shelley
Post Number: 16
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, July 31, 2004 - 12:13 pm: | |
Hi,
Just by going on brief memory, i think it was at least three witnesses that mentioned a dark or black 'felt hat'...well spotted, i'll check every one and find out which policeman or if it was policemen, that took the statements down.
Cheers
Shelley
Criminology Student (Ad Crim) |
Richard London
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Sunday, September 12, 2004 - 7:24 am: | |
Does anyone know what happened to Mary Ann Cox? |
